A FIRESIDE CHAT WITH JASON MORAN -
By: Fred Jung

Man alive, do I like Jason Moran. People may think he is cocky, but so what? His talent and adventurous sense of personal style (like his patron, Greg Osby) allows him to have that kind of brass. Just check out his latest Blue Note release, Facing Left. Moran includes "Murder of Don Fanucci," from my favorite motion picture of all time, The Godfather (Part II). Before I rant on and on about Moran, I will allow you to have a brief glimpse of the man, the myth, unedited and in his own words.

FRED JUNG: Let's start from the beginning.

JASON MORAN: My parents put my brothers and I in music lessons at around age six or seven. My younger brother and I played piano. My older brother played violin. Then while we were in school, we played in the orchestra and so at a certain point, in our teenage years, we all wanted to quit because my older brother quit violin. We all wanted to quit playing piano or any instrument and so we quit. That was my turning point, I thought to do something else. I had interests in being a zoologist or working with snakes. Then I heard, my dad had a lot of records and was always playing music in the car and so I heard a Thelonious Monk record and he was playing "' Round Midnight" and that kind of gave me the kicking in the butt I needed to go back to the piano and try to play some more. So I rejoined the piano. By that time, I was high school and I split my time between piano and golf. I gave golf up and stayed with the piano on through high school. I went to a performing and visual arts high school. I was there with Eric Harland. After I graduated from there, I went to New York to study with Jaki Byard at the Manhattan School of Music for four years. Eric Harland followed me up to New York the next year and so we were the first few Houstonians in New York. Now there is a plethora of them. After, that Eric got a call to do a record with Rodney Jones and he met Greg Osby on that record session. Greg called Eric to start playing in his band and Greg needed a piano player to play in his band for a European tour and Eric gave me a strong recommendation. Greg called me and hired me for the gig without even hearing me play, ever. So I did the tour and the rest is pretty much history. I did a couple of records with Greg and Blue Note got interested and so I did the first record, Soundtrack to Human Motion.

FJ: The old guard likes to see that a young player has paid his or her dues and does their time as a sideman with an established artist, jazz' mandatory apprenticeship program. You fast tracked and that must have pissed more than a few people off.

JASON MORAN: No, because what is the slack? If you can play, you can play. It doesn't matter where you come from. Plus, the people's whose bands I have been in, Steve Coleman's band for a short amount of time, Cassandra Wilson, and all the random people's bands, even the people that the media or public doesn't know, just the gigs playing with random singers in New York. I mean I met Lonnie Plaxico playing with a singer, Carla Cook, who now has a record out. We were doing a gig on 145th Street at a restaurant and Lonnie Plaxico was playing with her. It is the same thing. It is just as important to play with people that aren't known as it is to play with people who are known. Name recognition doesn't mean anything. I have always said that I don't care who you're playing with, or how many gigs you have, or how many months out of the year you are touring. If your music ain't happening, then it ain't happening, so for me, that is very trivial. Plus, adversity, I have read some place, what everyone else had to go through, they were all just paving the road. Everyone has their own trials and tribulations throughout every life. Nobody has an easy road and if you think it was an easy road to get to this point, then you are mistaken. There is a lot of hard work that goes into just trying to be an artist or just to be one. There is a lot of studying that has to go with it and a lot of artists or musicians, at a certain point, quit that study. Therefore, their art receives no benefit from that. I am at a young age and so you have to keep studying because I am trying to go until I die. That is what Jaki did and Muhal is doing and Andrew is doing and Randy Weston is doing. They are all going until they die, accepting every new challenge and every new idea that they can.

FJ: What is it about Jaki Byard, Muhal Richard Abrams, Andrew Hill, and Randy Weston?

JASON MORAN: A cat like Randy Weston, I really didn't realize his genius until this concert I heard a couple of months ago. He played a Duke Ellington solo piano concert. A solo concert really reveals what you have as a musician at the piano, or whatever instrument you're playing. So I heard him with his band and that was good, but to hear him solo was just amazing. Those cats, Jaki, along with Andrew and Muhal, they use the entire piano. There isn't one note that they disregard and I will say that in listening to a lot of music now. Certain piano players and instrumentalists in general stay in a certain range because it is comfortable and that is what you are used to listening to, rather than really exploring every option that the instrument offers. Watching Randy Weston play that solo concert and how he made that piano just sound like an entire band, how he made the bass register of the piano really sing was phenomenal and just rhythm and time and it wasn't all straight. He played a tribute to Duke Ellington and so he played all these Duke Ellington songs. People want to hear "Take the A Train" played the same way and my God, he did something to it that I would never ever think of doing, which was beautiful to hear. He is someone that is doing something that really surprises you and the same with Muhal and the same with Andrew. They all played that concert and to hear Andrew Hill play some Duke Ellington songs will throw you for a loop and test whether or not you really know those songs. I heard him play "Come Sunday" and Geri Allen play "Come Sunday" with her trio and the two were vastly different. Andrew's was so fragmented and chopped up that it was like a puzzle that you had to put together in your mind. They don't take anything for granted and they are as free as they want to be and that is the real beauty of so called musical art.

FJ: It's been a very good year for you and Andrew Hill. Both of you took home awards at the Jazz Awards presented by the Jazz Journalists Association. When all is said and done, are the accolades anything to write home to mom about?

JASON MORAN: No, I mean, it is great and I am grateful for it, but overall, it doesn't matter. I've never been a fan of competitions as far as like music or art is concerned because it is so objective. Different people see different things and to say what is right or wrong, it is fool hearty and something that shouldn't be done. So you have competitions like the Thelonious Monk Competition and Jaki Byard told me to not ever join a competition because there is nothing in it for you. He said that he sat on a judging panel one time and they got a tape and they didn't even listen to the person's name because they couldn't pronounce the name. They just threw the tape in the next pile and went on. It is that type of stuff, but also, you can't grade art. You can listen to it and say whether or not you like it or not, but to say that if it is right or wrong or to say that it is better than this or better than that. It is a mistake that many people shouldn't make. If you like it, that is great and if you don't like it, you don't like it. I have had this conversation with many teachers while I was in school, who tried to get on me because they would say that I was comping this way or that way and that I couldn't do that. I'd say, "What? I can't? The day that you tell me how to play or what I can or can't do at a piano is the day I'm dead because that's not going to happen." I tried to let many teachers know that. That is not the type of environment that I would like to be in as a student. You want to be able to examine every aspect of every idea that you have in your mind and hopefully, receive some encouragement from your teachers to keep going on that path. It doesn't matter in the end. What matters to me is to keep trying to create music that is truthful to myself and truthful to the band members that I am writing for and as a whole, try to keep the music going in a forward direction. If you are playing from the heart and you are playing what is true to you, then people will recognize that regardless. You have to keep doing what you are doing and not get caught up in the hype.

FJ: Let's touch on your latest release on Blue Note, Facing Left.

JASON MORAN: I think it is a lot older (laughing). It is full of ego (laughing). I'm humble in some areas of my life, but overall, I'm not. I think there was a lot of attitude in this record from each musician also, from Tarus and from Nasheet especially. We really wanted to make a statement as far as the options of this jazz trio, this piano trio.

FJ: But don't you think that the standard piano trio has been played out?

JASON MORAN: Well, that's why I selected music that was going to really exhibit how we could deconstruct and really tear these tunes apart and represent them in a different fashion. That's I chose songs by Duke Ellington that weren't very well known at all. People know "Wig Wise" because of the Money Jungle record, but "Later" is a very rare piece of music that is heard by the public. A lot of the stuff, people say that it is hard to determine where the solo starts and where the head ends. I've always been attracted to stylists of the music as well as the composers like Thelonious Monk, who played a Gershwin piece and it wouldn't sound like a Gershwin piece. So overall, I really wanted to make the connection between this trio that is formed now and the trios of the past that I really, really dug like the trio with Herbie Nichols, and Thelonious Monk's trio, Cecil Taylor Trio, McCoy Tyner Trio, Ahmad Jamal Trio. Those trios were laying down the law. So I wanted to lay down my law and make it be somewhat interesting to everyone who would listen to it. I think that it proved its point.

FJ: What is with the title, Facing Left?

JASON MORAN: That is based on an Egon Schiele painting. I was looking through a catalog of his and there was a self-portrait titled Facing Left. Egon Schiele is like a really killing artist and he drew people who look emaciated and not disfigured, but very frail people. He was a student of Gustav Klimt and so I always related to him because I went to see his show a couple of years ago at the MOMA (Museum of Modern Art) and there was a piece that he drew of himself in the front and Gustav Klimt peering over his shoulder. I always felt that way and that is how Jaki Byard like a teacher that you learn so much from and everything you play is a reflection of him also. So Facing Left, I said that that kind of suits the music on the record. It is not anti-trio, but this is other option. People always checked out the Wynton Kelly and the Red Garland trios and they never checked out the other side, which was like the Herbie Nichols Trio, Thelonious Monk at the time. So I always considered myself on the left side of the track and so Facing Left is where we're going, over in that direction and not in the right direction or what is considered right because most jazz trios serve more as a background music on a soap opera. It is very tight and everything is very tightly arranged and it sounds the same every night when they play the arrangements. The solos are in the same order and they never try anything new. I wanted to make that point and Facing Left, I thought was the perfect title, written by who I think was a perfect artist.

FJ: You try your hand at the Rhodes and Hammond B-3 on a tune.

JASON MORAN: Yeah, sadly, I am not a great organist. Well, this is the laziness in me. I really want to start practicing more, basically, because there is a lot of options there. On that piece, "Battle of the Cattle Acts," I use it as a background instrument and use these sounds that are almost reminiscent of Scooby Doo. I was pulling the register bars back and forth and I wanted to make the organ sound like Jimmy Smith's organ. There are other options just like the piano and that was my other option. Sadly, I am not a great organist. I'm not close. I'm not an organist. I like to practice it. Later on, I want to start performing on the organ as well as the piano.

FJ: I am curious as to your selection of "Yojimbo."

JASON MORAN: That is by a Japanese composer, Motaru Sato. That is from a movie titled Yojimbo by Akira Kurosawa. This is the opening theme in that movie. When I saw the movie, I made an MD of it and I used to listen to it on the street when I was walking around. Yojimbo means bodyguard and so he is a samurai who has no master and so it opens up and he's like in the fields with his sword and with his robe on and then this music is playing and he is just walking around (laughing). I wrote it out and decided to play it and we played it and I decided to record it. Yojimbo is a bad movie.

FJ: And my personal theme song, "Murder of Don Fanucci."

JASON MORAN: That is from The Godfather Part II. I remembered that song from the first time I seen the movie, which was maybe twelve years ago. Then I watched it over and over again and so then it became a fixture in my mind, almost like the main theme of Godfather. The music was written Carmine Coppola, which was Francis Ford's father. When I would come to that theme where Robert De Niro was about to murder Don Fanucci, he saw him on top of the roof and Don Fanucci is wearing a white top hat and it was almost like he is about to kill a dove or something and Robert De Niro is an eagle. It is very raw. I enjoyed that. The music behind that theme is being played by this band walking through the streets and I always thought of that as a great drum feature and so I made it a drum feature on the record and now we perform that often.

FJ: What are some of your current listening pleasures?

JASON MORAN: My brother is here now and any time he comes up, I usually fall back into my hip-hop upbringing. Now it is this band called Slum Village. They are from Detroit. They are very relaxed and it is almost like a throwback to the party days. None of the lyrics are about killing or nothing like that. It is really about having a good time. Slum Village and they are coming to town tomorrow so I am going to go check them out at the Knitting Factory. They are going to be there two nights. That is where I am at right now.

FJ: I have a movie pick for you. Ghost Dog: The Way of the Samurai.

JASON MORAN: Oh, I saw it! That is killing, Fred. You know, Fred, a lot of people didn't really like it and I was like, you have to look at it from a wider angle.

FJ: It is deep.

JASON MORAN: Yeah, plus I was wondering what RZA would do with it and I thought his music fit very well. It was very rough and that is how Ghost Dog was. He was a fool, but he was a smart fool. Actually, Fred, Cassandra Wilson's husband was in that too.

FJ: No shit.

JASON MORAN: Yeah, he is the French cat who had the ice cream truck.

FJ: Get out.

JASON MORAN: Yeah, that is him. He is an actor and so it was good to see him really in a role. It is a good movie. I enjoyed it a lot, especially the smaller excerpts from the book he had, which I have yet to pick up. I read a book that Steve and Greg recommended. It was called The Book of Five Rings by Miyamoto Musashi, who was supposedly the best samurai ever in Japan's history. No one could beat him and so he went up into the mountains and he wrote down his techniques and his techniques can be transferred to any type of venture you're in, whether it be working at a bank or working at a grocery store. It is just about life basically. That is the same type of literature that Ghost Dog was written. Yeah, that was a good movie. I enjoyed that one. We went to see something dumb yesterday, Scary Movie. That is some funny shit, Fred (laughing). It was a trip. It is like those Airplane movies, really slapstick, but it is funny.

FJ: You and I both play golf, which tends to humble even the biggest hard ons.

JASON MORAN: Yeah, I have been playing Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday and I haven't done in a long time. My brother and I used to play almost every day in our teens. We had gotten to a point where we got pretty good, but the sad thing is that I stopped taking lessons and so my technique kind of slipped and my form kind of slipped and so now I still have a decent game, but it is nowhere where I want to have it. It really is humbling, Fred. You go out one day and you shoot a 79 and the next day you shoot a 90 and the next day you may shoot a 99. It comes and goes, well, at least that is just my game.

FJ: You and I must be watching the same how to video because my stroke comes and goes as well.

JASON MORAN: Mine is all over the place. A lot of musicians play golf, Fred. Lou Donaldson is a big golfer. Branford is a big golfer now. Ray Brown plays a lot of golf.

FJ: Sounds like you would see more guys on the back nine than you would on the bandstand.

JASON MORAN: Probably. Sadly, I didn't call Lou Donaldson because I had a chance to meet him a couple of months and we were talking about golf and for a while, he talked about how he used to caddy at some of these country clubs and he plays a lot. He told me to give him a call because he is in the union book and I haven't called him, but eventually, I will because I definitely want to play with him just to say that I played a round of golf with Lou Donaldson (laughing).

FJ: Your affinity for solo piano, movies, Japanese self-help books, and golf, I see a trend here. By all accounts, you seem like going solo.

JASON MORAN: Yeah, yeah, I'm not a social lite, L-I-T-E (laughing). I go out when I have to and I mingle, but sometimes when I go out in public, you are still within a certain zone of yourself. I spend a lot of time in my apartment playing video games or I will call up Greg and see what he's doing and he is the same way (laughing). A lot of musicians, whoever I am calling, they are usually at home (laughing). I have always felt that I had everything I needed within my family. When I was growing up, I had a lot of friends, but my best friends were always my brothers. So I was never out searching for a good friend and I know a lot of people who are like that. I've always felt that my family provided such a strong backbone for me. There was always a sense of security within the home and a sense of security within yourself and my parents really had installed that upon myself and my brothers. I was never out searching for stuff because most of it ends up being trivial and a lot of musicians, after the gig, they search out for women to whatever, well, you know the reason.

FJ: How come you aren't chasing tail?

JASON MORAN: Well, what is the use? I have a woman already. I'm not married or nothing, but I have a girlfriend and some of these cats are really bold about it and they go for it every time and for me, it is just a waste. It is a waste of time. I would rather spend my time going to sleep (laughing). I don't need to waste my energy. After you have already played, it is draining enough. I don't have to urge to say that I want to get with that girl or fuck it, I am going over there and I'm going to deal with that. It is just really a waste. The Book of Five Rings says that one should sustain their energy and keep themselves away from meaningless activities at all times. I haven't reached that point where I am always studying. I too lazy and sometimes I put it on hold. I am just trying to get rid of all the excess activity in my life and it is very, very difficult. There are objects around all the time. Golf is a one man sport. Solo piano is a one man sport and like you said, Fred, playing video games is a one man sport.

FJ: You would be a good contestant on Survivor.

JASON MORAN: My apartment is my island. I go to the roof and look at the Hudson River. I go out often. I don't want to make it seem like I never go out because that is not true.

FJ: And the future?

JASON MORAN: I am hoping to go back into the studio. I have some projects that I need to pitch to the record company before I do that because I want to make sure that they are definite about doing them. There is one that I really wanted to do while Jaki was around and I took for granted life. I wanted to do a duet recording of two pianos. I wanted to get Andrew and Muhal and Randy Weston and do two pianos and like three songs a piece or something like that. We will see about that. I want to do a live date also, almost in the vein of a low budget Banned in New York thing. It doesn't have to be too much production behind it. You just set up one mic and have people yapping behind you. I definitely want to do a record with strings and I definitely want to do a record with vocals, but vocals in with every aspect of what the voice can do, a rapper, a classical singer, a R&B singer, choirs, that is the vein I am looking towards now, in addition to the standard quartet and trio type stuff and a solo record definitely.

FJ: You think you're ready for a solo record?

JASON MORAN: I have been ready since I was in high school, when I had to play it at restaurants and hotels and lounges. I have always enjoyed playing solo piano and I always think that it is important for every instrumentalist, regardless of what they play, they should be able to hold their own just at their instrument without the aid of anyone else. Solo piano is definitely a forum with rich history. You've got Errol Garner. You've got Art Tatum. You've got James P. Johnson. You've got Cecil Taylor and Thelonious Monk. The history is very rich and so I definitely want to try my hand and write some songs that would be especially written for solo piano, maybe some classical type music and whatever else. I could go into the studio and do that in two hours (laughing), just set up some stuff and then record. It shouldn't be hard to do.

Fred Jung is Jazz Weekly's Editor-In-Chief and Fire Starter.